Western Europe still needs to confront the reality of EU enlargement: an interview with EU Commissioner Gunther Verheugen
No other European politician can rival the German Social Democrat Gunther Verheugen in the huge role he has played in steering the countries of Central Europe towards the European Union. As the EU Commissioner for enlargement since September 1999, he has travelled over vast areas of the region and has become a familiar face to millions of Central Europeans. In his native Germany he has also been tipped as a future foreign minister. With just nine months to go until the biggest enlargement in EU history, Gunther Verheugen is our guest in today's Talking Point. When I met him in Berlin a few days ago I began by asking whether his work as Commissioner for enlargement had changed his perspective on the continent.
"I must say that the Eastern and Central European countries really changed my mind and today, at the moment when the process is almost completed, I have to say that I really admire the commitment, the strength and the patience of people in Eastern and Central Europe. They will be members of the European Union soon, but not as an act of charity. They will be members because they are well prepared and they earned it. How that was done, that in my view is really a miracle."
Do you think that this process is understood in the countries that are already members of the European Union, for example in your native Germany?
"Certainly not everywhere, and I'm really afraid that public opinion in my own country, but also in other member states doesn't really understand what the reality in the future member states is. I think that many people still believe that these are backward countries with low technological skills, low education systems, which is definitely not true. What we will get is much tougher competition. The new member states have a strong advantage in having a highly motivated and skilled labour force. They have high technological skills and they have a strong commitment to political, economic and social reform. Not many people in our member states understand this and my advice would be to study the reality soon. Otherwise they will experience a very bad surprise."
The European Union - or the European Community as it was then - was built on an axis between France and Germany on the basis of not letting what had happened before happen again. That still seems to be in Western Europe the basis of the identity of the European Union, but that's going to have to change as well, isn't it?
"I'm not so sure. I think that the present process of European integration has a lot in common with the beginning. At the beginning the idea was to use the model of economic integration as an instrument to guarantee peace and stability. They used the same instrument, by the way, when Spain and Portugal joined the European Union. It was not for economic reasons. The reason was to stabilize young democracies and to ensure that dictatorship would never have a chance again in these countries. And now we have the young democracies in Eastern and Central Europe, and again it was not so much about quotas and customs and tariffs. It was about peace, it was about stability, it was about democracy, it was about individual freedom. Therefore I think it has much more in common with the principles of the founding fathers and mothers than many people believe. So I do not see such a big difference here. In reality European integration is about peace and stability. That's what we have to learn from our history in the 19th and 20th centuries, and the model of European integration is a completely new model. It is unique in the world, but so far it is the only successful model that we ever have developed in the history of Europe to organize a peaceful living together of the many European nations."
You've been travelling backwards and forwards to the candidate countries over the last few years. You must have so many different experiences from your travels. What have been some of the stranger things, or unexpected things that you've experienced on your travels in Central Europe?
"I think that what I did not expect was how strong the cultural identity and how strong the historical traditions are which bind us together. But this is not really surprising in the case of Prague, which was always a Central European capital, if not the Central European capital. It's also not surprising in the case of Budapest. But if you look at Vilnius, at Talinn, or at a city like Lodz in Poland, it is really striking that it is not a culture that is very far away from Western Europe, but it is a culture that is closely linked to our culture, our traditions and is really European. So what I have found during these travels is exactly that there is something that we can describe as a European identity, and it has to do with diversity on the one side and something that binds us together on the other side."
And specifically with the Czech Republic, sometimes it seems to be a country that is very provincial, very introverted. Would you agree with that, generally speaking?
"No. That I would not say. I don't see the Czechs as introverted. I would describe the Czechs as cautious and perhaps a little bit suspicious as a result of history. If you consider the history of the Czech nation since the 16th century, I would say, it is a history that must lead people to the conclusion that you have to be careful vis-à-vis your neighbours, that you have to be careful vis-à-vis overarching structures. So I think that the specific Czech character is deeply rooted in the collective memory and the collective history of that nation. My understanding is that especially the Czechs always come to the right conclusion, and after some difficulties and after careful consideration do the right things."
Again and again in Czech-German relations or in Czech-Austrian relations, the question of the Benes Decrees comes up, of the Sudeten Germans who were expelled from Czechoslovakia after the war. There's also the question of Temelin, the nuclear power plant, that comes up again and again. In your job as European Commissioner for enlargement it must have been incredibly frustrating, these questions coming back again and again.
"Well, Temelin was a different case, and Temelin is a successful model of - shall I say - mediation of a very difficult conflict. I was able to act as a mediator between the two countries and we found a solution which is solid, and by the way a solution which could serve as a model for other neighbouring countries, because no other country in the world, as a neighbouring country, got so much as Austria got from the Czechs. So I think Temelin is OK. The Benes Decrees is a difficult issue. It is now strictly bilateral. From the European Union's point of view there is nothing that we must do and can do. We have carefully checked the situation, carefully examined the question whether the legal system in the Czech Republic is in full harmony with the requirements of the European Union, and that is the case. But many people do not understand this. They say - but injustice was done in the past. That's right. Injustice was done in the past, but the question for membership today is not whether injustice was done in the past. The question is whether the legal system of today would allow it again to do injustice to people, and that's not the case in the Czech Republic. If you were to try to solve all the problems of the past in the context of the European Union, I have to say that not many of the present member states would be members. So from my point of view, this is now a strictly bilateral issue between the Czech Republic and Germany and the Czech Republic and Austria. From the European point of view it is certainly desirable and preferable to encourage the countries to develop the best possible good neighbourly relations and if we can help them to do it we will do it. But there's nothing that we have to respect from the Czech Republic in that respect."
The process of admitting ten further countries is now complete. It's going to happen on 1st May 2004. Do you now feel that your work is done?
Gunther Verheugen: "Not completely. I think that I still have a role to play to guarantee or to help the process to run smoothly after accession, that there will be no conflicts, no problems, that institutions and policy will run properly. I certainly have to be available to help our future member states if there are unforeseen difficulties, and I have to say that the process is not yet finished. We have still Bulgaria and Romania so to say in the pipeline, and we have the very serious question of Turkey. That still needs and answer, so it's not completed. What I can say gives me some satisfaction is that the basic work is done, and it's certainly true that what we have done will change the future of Europe and the history of Europe. And it gives a feeling of high satisfaction that I could be a part of this process."
