Colonel Petr Uruba - NATO means freedom
Rob Cameron's guest on this week's One on One is Colonel Petr Uruba, a distinguished pilot, RAF veteran and former Colditz inmate, who like many of his fellow officers was persecuted by the Communist regime after returning home. Colonel Uruba was delighted to see NATO meet in the Czech capital last week - he actually received a medal from the alliance for promoting NATO membership. When he came into the studio, Rob began by asking him if flying had always been a passion.
"Well it is a passion, actually. Once you get into the air you feel really free and it's a sensation. So, it is. It is a passion."
You joined the Czechoslovak air force at the age of 18, as a young man. Hundreds of Czechoslovak pilots fled Czechoslovakia in the months leading up to and directly after the Nazi occupation, and many made their way to Britain to join the RAF. Can you tell me how you made your journey?
"Well, the occupation of our country on March 15, 1939 was a such a shock for me. Naturally we finished our military service, we were sent back to our families and to our villages and towns, and the Germans were more or less everywhere. So I said to myself, this is not a place for me to live in. There was no freedom, you couldn't express yourself freely. So I decided I had to get out of the country and to a free land."
Was it still for you - as a young man - a great adventure, or were you greatly depressed and saddened at what had happened to your country?
"More or less it was a patriotic duty, with of course the possibility of adventure. But the main idea was to get out of the occupied country and do something in the struggle which we had expected."
What's your first memory of arriving in Britain?
"Yes, well. When we left Bordeaux, and arrived in Falmouth, we were offered our first ever British tea."
Did you like it?
"Oh yes. British tea is the best. No-one can make the tea the way they do in England, or Great Britain. But as I was saying, the fighters were sent to Duxford, which was the base for Royal Air Force fighters and for the group of Czechs who arrived there. And after a very short time, we were put into aerial combat. We were really welcomed in Great Britain, and the RAF did all they could to make use of our fighters. But we started off by bombing the ports on the Channel, because the Germans were gathering their ships for the possible invasion of Britain...it was a silly idea, because the last invasion was William the Conqueror...but there were the ships, ready. So we bombed those ships, landing craft and so on. And that was our first effort, and that was part of the Battle of Britain."
You were shot down, and captured...
"No, actually it was an error by the navigator, together with a bad weather forecast. We were actually on a trip to Boulogne, which is just across the Channel, but when flying back, after we'd bombed Boulogne, as we flew to the North Sea the drift was such that we ended back again over the Channel, and landed by mistake on the Normandy peninsula, near the town of Fleurs. So there we were taken prisoner."
...and you spent some time in the infamous Colditz POW camp, which has been immortalised in numerous books and Hollywood films. Tell me about the Colditz that you remember. What do you remember about your cell, of the discipline there?
"Well, naturally we had roll call every morning and afternoon. That is something every prisoner has to obey. So I knew that as a prisoner of war, I had to at least annoy the German guards and so on. So my passive resistance was that when I took the roll call, I was always the last to run out! So everybody was standing there, and the German warrant officer who was supervising the roll call, when he saw me he said "Ah well...Uruba - immer der letzer!" - "Uruba - always the last!"
Moving on to after the war, the fate of Czechoslovak airmen who risked their lives for freedom, to liberate their country from the Nazis, is a painful one. Those who chose to come back to Czechoslovakia after 1945 were thrown into prison by the Communists, many of them died there, they were tortured. What happened to you after the war?
"Well, that was a surprise really. Because it was a coup d'etat in the classic sense. And that was the end for us. They said 'you are those who fought on the wrong side. You were helping to win the war for the capitalists!' Well, it was silly really. Because nearly all of us didn't come from rich families. Still, after a few months we were all chased out of the forces. No chance for us."
And many sent to prison.
"And sent to prison, those who were active in the war."
Obviously the story of what happened to Czechoslovak airmen was suppressed during the Communist regime. Only after 1989 did it really come out just how badly they were treated. Do you think there is enough awareness among people - especially young people - about exactly what happened to you and your colleagues after 1948?
"To tell you the truth, young people are not interested. Because it's been already...how long? 50 years. They didn't live in the situation we were living in."
Does that sadden you when you realise how much people have forgotten?
"No, I understand that they have other interests. If there was the need, and I hope there will never be the need to do what we did...and that's why I have always been a strong supporter of joining NATO."
Right, well that's what I want to move onto. Prague has just hosted the first ever NATO summit in a post-Communist country. I remember shortly before the Czech Republic joined the Alliance, many people said for this country, invaded by the Nazis in 1939, the Russians in 1968, there is simply no alternative to joining NATO, to guarantee security in the future. Do you agree with that, and how much relevance does that have today?
"Yes, to me it was clear. After what we have witnessed - occupation by Germans, and then again occupation by our allies and friends! So, I went into a rage. I said 'we've got to get someone who has the power to help us, to guarantee the freedom'. I saw that the only possibility was the large North Atlantic Treaty Organisation. And remember: it was the United States forces that decided the First World War. When the warring forces here on European battlefields were exhausted, the Americans came, and the last onslaught made the victory of Allies in the First World War. In the Second World War, again, you had the invasion in June 1944. They are still there, and they are ready to help us. They are there, always ready, to help the old Europe."
