Sahib al-Nassir - Iraqi exile hoping one day to return to Baghdad
Rob Cameron's guest on this week's One on One is Sahib al-Nassir, an Iraqi-born architect turned bar owner who's made Prague his home. Sahib studied architecture in Prague and Baghdad, but in 1977 he decided to flee the regime of Saddam Hussein and live permanently abroad, first in London, then in Prague. He now owns a popular bar called Cheers, and is also involved in property development.
Sahib, why did you leave your homeland?
"Well, it's very frightening, very sad, actually. I had to leave, because we were being chased in '75 by his security. Although we weren't politicians, they followed any successful man, trying to get us to collaborate with their security services. I sustained it for one year, telling them stories, but then it was very hard and I had to leave, at the end of '76."
That must have been a very difficult decision, leaving your country.
"Very difficult. We had to pack up the whole family, everything. And go to England, a new country where we'd never lived before. That's why I appreciate England very much because they welcomed us and I found shelter and peace there."
Iraqi exiles seem to be far more in favour of the U.S. invasion, perhaps because they don't have to live with the chaos and mayhem that's followed. Are you in favour of what the Americans did in Iraq?
"You see, nobody is favour of an occupation. But imagine you're on a stretcher and will die. Do you say no to a doctor who will perform an operation and save your life? We don't like it, but they helped us. All the opposition had fled, and there was no way to turn Saddam out and get rid of this system. So in fact it is a very great help, and we owe that to them."
Are you in contact with people back in Iraq?
"Yes I have half of my family there. I think they are of the same opinion. Their lives have so far changed very little, but at least they're not chased by the security, and nobody is knocking on their door saying Come join the army, Come join the Party, Come join this and that. Now, OK, they are fighting terrorism, but they are free at least to move freely and talk freely and that's very important."
Have you had the opportunity to go back to Iraq?
"Not me, but my brother did, about seven months ago. He stayed for two months and he told me a lot of stories. The general opinion is Thank you for helping us, Thank you for liberating us, but we need peace and we need the basic requirement of life, to live as decent people, so they are waiting for when this terrorist episode will finish and they can get rid of the fear with which they live every day."
When do you think that will happen? When do you think Iraq will become a normal, stable, democratic country?
"It's very difficult. The way we see democracy in the West is very difficult to implement in the Arab world. But as far as being free, feeling free, having that feel-good factor, it will come. They're working on it. I hope it will come. There are some mistakes, but if you do nothing you don't make mistakes. Maybe two or three years. I think the biggest obstacle are the terrorists, al Qaeda and the diehard Saddamis. You see, Saddam's people are fighting for their lives. Because if democracy and freedom in Iraq will prevail, they will be taken to court because they've killed people and tortured people. They know that one day they will have to face justice. So it's a matter of life or death for them. This is the way I see it."
Do you miss your homeland?
"Oh very much so."
What is it about Iraq that you miss most?
"We lived in Iraq when there was peace, quiet. It's a very natural country. Iraqis were never known to emigrate somewhere, to live somewhere else. It was always a rich country, I don't mean in petrol but in water, in agriculture, in education and heritage. And especially if you live that part of your life as a young man, these are the moments when you remain very long with you and you can't forget about them. So I hope one day I'll go back there."
"Me personally I have no problem with anybody. Prague is very civilized. Czech people are very civilized. I haven't noticed anything. Sometimes - but this also happens in England - because of your name they look at you one and a half times instead of once. But I understand the fear they have of those terrorists coming from those areas. I will understand and I will appreciate that. I wouldn't take any notice of it and I take it as a normal way of life."
So you haven't noticed any greater hostility to people like yourself since September 11, and the attacks on Madrid and London?
"No, on the contrary. A lot of people, friends who know me, show a lot of appreciation and sympathy for what happened in Iraq, in London, in Madrid. I think the Czech people are very civilized and they will not be intimidated by one or two or three terrorist incidents."
Do you think Prague could ever be targeted by Islamic extremists?
"I don't know. I hope not. I really hope not. It would be a pity. Anywhere in the world would be a pity. Nobody actually understands why those idiots do something like that. It's far away from any religion, be it Judaism, Christianity, Islam. They are fanatics. And a fanatic for me is an ignoramus, because he listens to himself, and he won't learn from a normal dialogue or conversation with anybody. I don't understand them. I hope it never happens here."
Well let's hope we never have the opportunity to find out.
"I hope to God. What I would say to all people from the Arab world, from the Third World etc, they should really stop being neutral and they should do something. Because that hurts them and hurts all innocent people. They should collaborate - by collaborate I don't mean being a spy or whatever - but at least they should speak out loudly and say 'this is bad, stop it'. Being neutral and finding reasons or excuses for them, I think that will encourage those terrorists more. Because they think 'Alright, we have a reason'. Whereas in fact there is no reason, none whatsoever, to kill an innocent person."
